Stuff to Read While You’re Pretending to Work: CrossFit, Chin-Ups, MIRU Re-Loaded
A few weeks ago, in THIS Miscellaneous Miscellany Monday post, I linked to a random CrossFit video that was sent my way from another reader. I thought it was funny. I posted it. I moved on with my life.
Maybe a day or two later, someone by the name of Pete made the following comment – apparently he wasn’t too happy with my facetiousness:
“Tony Gentilcore on the crossfit slating bandwagon! You do realise that a lot of your websites traffic comes from people who got into the big lifts after being introduced to Crossfit? I am one of many who did Crossfit, fell in love with the big lifts and moved on. Training large multi-joint movements is hugely popular now, thanks to them. Like I said, I don’t do it, but laugh when I hear it mocked because nobody can ever give a genuine reason as to why it’s shit, and usually collapse on their ass if they try it.”
My response (with Rocky music playing in the background):
For the record, Pete, I’ve also put videos on this site that have shown powerlifters spliting their pants during a meet, guys passing out while deadlifting, and people failing on bench press attempts, etc……so I don’t really feel posting a (funny to me) video on Crossfit is anything to get all huffy about. Funny is funny. Period.
Are there things about CrossFit I disagree with? Absolutely! I’ve personally trained people who were seriously injured following a WOD – in one instance a female client was hospitalized with Rhabdomyolysis for a week – and subsequently started training at my facility instead.
There’s this weird thing called coaching, and we pride ourselves on the fact that we actually teach our clients how to perform movements correctly and not to kill themselves. More to the point, there’s some semblance of individualization with their programming.
For the most part – and there ARE exceptions – CrossFit’s programming is a joke. There’s no rhyme or reason to what they do.
They have awesome attire, though
Do they make people work hard? Yep. But priding yourself on your ability to make people shit their kidneys doesn’t really impress me.
But, that isn’t to say that there aren’t affiliates who do it right. My friend, Jen Sinkler, has written several times on how her affiliate has more of a strength focus, and actually coaches their clients on how to lift properly. Great!
That’s an exception rather than a rule, though. It’s unfortunate, but sadly the truth.
In the end, I’m sorry if you took offense to the video. Get over it.
To his credit, Pete did respond back with: A rational and comprehensive reason as to why Crossfit is no good.
I thought so, too. But lets not throw the baby out with the bathwater here. While there certainly are a host of things about CrossFit that I don’t agree with, to say that it’s entirely “no good” is a bit harsh. They make people work hard, they place an emphasis on compound movements, and you certainly would be hard pressed to find a better environment of teamwork and camaraderie
For a better perspective, though, check out this article.
Inside the Cult of CrossFit – Grant Stoddard
I thought this was an excellent piece of writing that gave some semblance of equal weight to both sides of the coin – although, to be fair, it has a bit more of an anti-CrossFit flavor to it. Read it, and you can decide for yourself.
How to Improve Your Chin-Ups – Charles Poliquin
While I don’t necessarily agree with Coach’s assertion that any trainer who can’t get his female client to perform twelve unassisted chin-ups doesn’t know training, and is therefore a bad trainer – I can’t say that I disagree with the rest of the article. Excellent advice!
Muscle Imbalances Revealed – Upper Body RE-LOADED – Myself, Rick Kaselj, Dean Somerset, and Dr. Jeff Cubos
Unlike The Matrix Re-Loaded, this sequel doesn’t suck. In the few months since we originally released MIRU, we’ve received a ton of positive feedback and we’ve gone a head and added some extra material into the mix.
The coolest addition, though, at least in my eyes, is the fact that MIRU 2.0 is now available in DVD format! What’s more, it’s on sale for the rest of the week at $70 dollars off the original price. No diggidy, no doubt!
Don’t miss out on this awesome opportunity, and keep your eyes peeled for an announcement of a possible live event that’s in the works for sometime next summer. OMGOMGOMG!! I peed myself a little, I’m so excited.
And finally, I stole this video from the Weighty Matters blog, and thought I’d share it with the rest of you because I thought it was awesome.
If that doesn’t make you appreciate the smaller things in life, I don’t know what will.
Comments for This Entry
Michael Gray
While not a fan of CrossFit, I think there are a few good aspects to it. However, I completely disagree with anyone not being able to defend why they don't like CrossFit. I actually find it quite easy. One of the biggest holes they have in their "programming" is a complete lack of horizontal pulling for strength. And no, rowing 500 meters for time is not even close to the same as heavy sets of DB Bent Over Rows in terms of correcting imbalances.November 16, 2011 at 9:29 am |
Stephane
Very good timing considering I'm currently writing an article about the subject. Either way though I've learned to have respect for some aspects of CrossFit but cannot get over the poor programming.November 16, 2011 at 9:51 am |
Cara
Seeing as I'm only halfway there, I think you need to stop slacking ;)November 16, 2011 at 10:11 am |
Pj Striet
Good article from Poliquin. I've benefited from his writings and own some of his books. However, he's way off base with his belief that if a trainer can't get a woman to do 12 pullups in a matter of weeks, he or she is a bad trainer. That's ridiculous. I train 2 champion figure competitors who can't do 12 Chinups.November 16, 2011 at 10:23 am |
Bryan Krahn
Well, to be fair, being an exceptional figure athlete doesn't *require* exceptional athletic ability. Just as there are *some* big, ripped bodybuilders who can't squat to depth or deadlift for beans, there are *some* nationally ranked figure gals that need their boyfriends to open a tube of mascara for them.November 17, 2011 at 2:16 pm |
Bill
"...it's like a cult crossed with a pyramid scheme..." That's one thing I had thought of as well that sort of concerns me. When I hear the founder, Greg Glassman, speak he sounds EXACTLY like a salesman trying to pitch a pyramid scheme.November 16, 2011 at 10:39 am |
Mike A.
I'm about to "defend" crossfit. Wow. When most of us think of Crossfit, we think of the crossfit homepage, and the clusterfuck that it started. Random, untrained people doing WOD's in their home gym or commercial gyms; just butchering their form. In reality, today's Crossfit Affiliates are concerning themselves more and more with legitimate strength programming. Obviously, this doesn't hold true for all of them, but I don't want to generalize either positively or negatively here. A lot of the affiliates will perform a class strictly aimed at improving maximal strength in a particular lift (say, deadlifts 6x3), or an olympic lifting class where they work on both technique and maximal strength. After these classes, they will go on to perform a WOD (not always the one posted on the crossfit main site). Gone are the days when you just show up to your local affiliate and do your WOD, then go outside and puke. I am not a crossfitter, never have been: I have my disagreements with the whole system just like every other conventional strength coach. A good friend of mine is a Crossfitter, though, and she has seen some great results with it. In fact, she has seen better results (both strength and body comp) during her time at Crossfit than she saw during her 4 months doing EC's Maximum Strength. She constantly tells me to not judge Crossfit until I spend some time doing it, she's probably right.November 16, 2011 at 11:15 am |
Brock
Here's my issue with that defense - by focusing more on strength, they are no longer doing Crossfit. Crossfit prides itself on being general in nature, and, as Assman has stated "punishing the specialist." I wholeheartedly agree with the idea of focusing on getting stronger on the big lifts and then adding in some lower-level "metcons" to get "in shape" (for the general population - not for athletes). The problem, however, is that you are no longer doing Crossfit! Which is great, btw, because Crossfit sucks.November 16, 2011 at 12:44 pm |
Mike A.
My issue with your reply about your issue with my defense (still cant believe I'm defending CF...Ali, you owe me) is that Assman (hahahaha, I like that) is that 'strength' is one of the 10 "domains" that CF builds its "programming" around. The goal for them is not to build up to a 1RM max, necessarily, but to build a lift so that when it comes to a WOD, they will be able to perform better. Stands to reason that if you can pull 550, you will be able to pull 225 for more reps during a WOD, than if you could only pull 315. It's true, they don't specialize in anything, which is true of all (well-coached) strength athletes. Very few athletes in this world should be specialized in anything, and the ones that should be are elite, world class athletes. Facilities like CP are built around balancing out the imbalances that specializing in something brings about. Even a gym that creates specialists (Westside) builds their programming around fixing and getting rid of imbalances. You suggest that doing focusing on building strength is "no longer doing CF", I'd suggest they are just training to get better for their chose "sport". In fact, when I went to watch Alison do her WOD a few weeks ago, the male coaches were setting up for a bench workout as we were leaving. Go figure.November 16, 2011 at 2:20 pm |
Brock
You are absolutely right that pretty much any program doesn't specialize in any one "domain", but it certainly skews toward it. Yes, getting stronger helps almost everything else, and that's why smart coaches skew their training toward it. Is it the only focus? Heck, no. But it is favorred. And that's the point I'm making. Couch would argue that getting stronger at the expense of other physical abilities is frowned upon, based upon the CF credo. And that's the point I'm making. Yes, great programming is well-rounded, but it does have a focus. At its core, and based on what they claim, CF does (or should) not.November 16, 2011 at 3:07 pm |
DBAR
You know what I like about your "arguments" guys? You were able to do it in a civil manner without name calling and internet bashing usually involved, that is awesome, seeing as I am tired of seeing people behaving horribly on the netNovember 16, 2011 at 5:21 pm
Anonymous
Yeah, we're pretty civil here on tonygentilcore.com. I just farted. Okay, in all seriousness, I think there's more of a middle ground than people think, and I'd be remiss not to take note of the many benefits of CrossFit. That said, as a strength coach, and as someone who spends a fairly good potion of his week "fixing" people, I can't help but cringe when I hear stories (like the one linked to in today's post) of people walking in on Day #1 and being told to perform deadlifts with 225 lbs on the bar without any formal assessment or instruction. As Allison notes, it seems that "old school" Crossfit WODs is more so a thing of the past, but I just don't see it. At least in the mainstream media anyways.November 16, 2011 at 7:12 pm
Ali
Working on, or focusing on, a weakness is highly encouraged in CrossFit. The idea is to be proficient in all 10 domains, and sometimes that means singling out individual movements and/or skills that aren't up to par. Many athletes have a "focus" without neglecting other areas.November 16, 2011 at 5:53 pm
Anonymous
You know......those are some great points. On one of my Tuesdays off, instead of training at your gym, you and I should head down to one of the CrossFit gyms in the city. I think I saw one near Fenway a few weekends ago.November 16, 2011 at 2:21 pm |
Ali
Tony - I'll send you the name of a quality box in Boston... or Mike can take you.November 16, 2011 at 2:36 pm |
Anonymous
Great! I'd be interested in stopping by one sometime soon, even if for nothing else than to observe. Do they allow people to come in a observe?November 16, 2011 at 7:13 pm |
Gaurav Kapil
Hi Tony, Rhabdomyolysis. This got me worried. I at times try to hit 8 workouts in 5 days (at times morning and evening). I remain hydrated, take my food properly for recovery and have Whey/Glutamine etc. Is this Rhabdomyolysis is still going to hit many of us who are trying to train hard?November 16, 2011 at 11:27 am |
Andrew
You guys seem to forget one of the main reasons why crossfit sucks: there is very little individualized programming. We get better physically when we address our needs physiologically. Your physiological needs are determined by looking at the interaction between your goals and your current fitness state. Does crossfit look at every single one of their client's goals and needs and create a well designed program to address their needs? No. They write a program up on a whiteboard and everyone does it. Some of the better facilities will provide progressions and regressions. Some of the better facilities will do some mobility and stability testing and prescribe corrective exercises. Some of the better facilities might by focusing on strength rather than daily, puke-inducing WOD's. Some of the better facilities will have somewhat consistent strength programming to address the need for specificity. But, in the end, the more these facilities start to move away from the one-size-fits-all daily WOD's, the less the are actually doing crossfit. That tells you something right there. Eventually, you might see these facilities doing all individualized and balanced programming, assessments, and the occasional "WOD" circuit for metabolic conditioning. I can think of a facility that trains people that way right now...................CP.November 16, 2011 at 11:40 am |
Bclc28
If you train athletes, you want a specifc adaptation to the energy system and movements they will use in their sport. Crossfit prides itself on having NOT a specifc adaptation. For example, If you train volleyball playersd, they need to jump high a lot. They need specific enegry system training of the ATP-CP system. They need to train their nervous system to jump. Not row for 500 meters. Crossfit for athletes????????????November 16, 2011 at 11:42 am |
J.B.
In may I was on an airplane and I struck up a conversation with the woman in the seat next to me. She was studying for the Crossfit level I cert. and she let me read her study guide. The thing that struck me about it was the phrase "Crossfit is a sport." Suddenly it all made sense to me. If you look at it as a competitive sport, and the WODs are practices/games for the sport, suddenly it makes more sense. It's still dangerous when compared to more traditional S&C programming, but so is hockey, baseball, or any other sport. The place where I get incredulous is when Crossfit zealots make claims about crossfit as a training modality for other sports. No one plays hockey to get in shape for football, so what sense does it make to "play" crossfit to get in shape for a completely different sport.November 16, 2011 at 1:14 pm |
Ali
It's been nearly 2 years since I started reading (and loving!) TG's blog, marking the moment in time when I first got off the arc trainer and starting deadlifting, squatting to real depth, benching more than the bar, running sprints and overall training like a real (badass) girl. I switched over to CrossFit in Sept 2010 when some friends from grad school (we got our master's in exercise physiology, funny) opened up a box and haven't looked back since. I still read, and enjoy, every single post here even though I now consider myself a *gasp* CrossFitter. The over generalization of why CrossFit is "bad" going on here and all over the internet is getting old. The majority of people that do CF no longer pride themselves on puking after a workout or getting rhabdo. That was old-skool CF, and while those idiotic people certainly still exist, I can say I've been to plenty of CF events, seen thousands of CrossFitters/Fans and have never once see a Pukie the Clown or Uncle Rhabdo t-shirt in the stands. As a coach, I would never "high five" an athlete after a workout if they puked (haven't seen it yet), nor do any of my colleagues act that way. CrossFitters now, as a majority in my eyes, pride themselves on getting stronger, faster and healthier - not "puking a kidney." Do some boxes suck? Do some trainers suck? Does the MAIN-SITE programming (occasionally to frequently) suck? OF COURSE. But let's not forget all the posts and comments we've made here about douchebag commercial gym trainers and all the ridiculousness seen in your average weight room. Stupidity and injury are NOT exclusive to CrossFit. It exists in thousands of gyms, college rec centers, high school football weight rooms, Pilates studios, fitness magazines, DVD's, celebrity trainers, etc. Making that generalization exclusive to CrossFit is getting old and nauseating. Last time I checked we are all responsible for our own actions and have the ability to independently choose the places and people we seek advice from. CrossFit boxes have come SO FAR in the past 5 years to address all of the "bad" (see above comment by Mike A.). It's up to the owners of a strength and conditioning facility to uphold their own professionalism, movement standards and assess the individual needs of the client - the same is true to the owners of a CrossFit. If the leadership sucks in any given facility, everything else probably sucks too, regardless of if it has CF in it's name or not. If it's awesome, it's going to be awesome, like Cressey Performance. So go ahead and bash the CF mainsite programming/headquarters babbling, but please, please don't bash it as a whole if you've never set foot into a legitimate affiliate. In fact, give it 3-4 months at said legitimate affiliate before you form your own opinion. You might still hate it, and that's fine with me, so long as you actually tried it. There are PLENTY out there that are able to use the CF methodology and tailor to individual needs, despite what you may hear. No one says you can't do horizontal rows in CrossFit, and we frequently program that sort of thing for our athletes. Maybe it's wishful thinking on my part, but I do sincerely think that the vast majority of boxes are now tailoring more to the individual. I am very grateful to have been a part of two exceptional programs so far. ps. This is the guy who wrote that Men's Health article... http://grantstoddard.com/about.php. That's all.November 16, 2011 at 1:20 pm |
Barath
I don't know enough about CrossFit to form an opinion one way or the other, but that comment of yours is a lesson on how to respectfully disagree with someone - beautifully written contrarian point of view.November 16, 2011 at 1:30 pm |
Ali
Thank you so much, Barath. That was my goal, I'm glad it came across that way. I love TG's blog and very much respect him and all of his followers who contribute to the comments/discussion on any given post.November 16, 2011 at 1:39 pm |
Anonymous
Alison - Thanks for such an awesome contribution, and I hope you DO realize that I'm NOT bashing every CrossFit affiliate out there. Like I said, I understand that there are those that do it correctly, actually teach their clients, and even program for them accordingly. In my experience, though, that's more the exception than the rule. I also recognize that - as I noted in my response to Pete - that there are positive qualities to Crossfit, and I can see how all the CG bashing gets old. I just felt the need to defend my thoughts on the matter when prompted. Anyways, hopefully there was no offense taken. TonyNovember 16, 2011 at 2:18 pm |
Ali
Hi Tony, I know that you aren't bashing every CrossFit out there and I appreciate you clarifying your point. I think part of what I'm trying to say that I'm not so sure that good affiliates really are the exception anymore... Or at the very least, that they are becoming LESS of an exception - does that make sense? I think there is quality stuff going on in a lot of boxes - otherwise one wouldn't see the caliber of the athletes that we see now in CF. Sometimes I think that it's hard for people on the outside of the community to see this - for a variety of reasons. I also wanted to apologize for mis quoting you. You really said "shitting a kidney" not "puking a kidney." Sorry! :) Anyways, keep up the great work. Happy lifting! AliNovember 16, 2011 at 2:31 pm
Mike A.
I would also like to mention, for what it's worth, that in addition to being very strong, and able to kick most of our asses, Alison is also extremely hot. And makes really good buffalo chicken meatballs.November 16, 2011 at 2:22 pm |
Lisa V.
While I agree with Poliquin that more people should do pull-ups/chin-ups, I invite him to spend a few months in the body of a 50 YO female and see how quickly he achieves 12 chin-ups. I am proud of my 4 sets of 3 unassisted, and am still working towards more, but I think it is unlikely I will ever see 12. And Tony, don't get any ideas about programming 10 sets of 6 either.November 16, 2011 at 1:56 pm |
DBAR
"Enjoy every sandwich" Any Zevon fans out there catch that reference?November 16, 2011 at 5:22 pm |
Pete
Wow. Some really legit points being made here. I think to say that Crossfit causes serious injury or lacks any programming for it's athletes is a pretty hollow statement. Injury is inherent to training full stop. How many people do you know who have been injured running or powerlifting? Would you then go on to claim that these sports are stupid? As for programming, i can safely say that almost nobody follows the mainsite workouts. As an example, Crossfit Bath won't even let anyone near a wod without completing an intro course and having each individual coached one on one until they are absolutely ready to take part. If a client needs to get stronger then they are sent in that direction. If mobility is the issue, guess what. This is the common theme amongst 99% of Crossfit gyms in the uk. These trainers are passionate beyond belief and dedicate their lives to getting people strong and healthy. They are an inspiration to so many who would otherwise be curling in the squat rack. Standards are high here, and thats why i took offence to a cheap shot at something that has such a positive effect on so many.November 17, 2011 at 3:29 am |
Anonymous
Pete! See, we can all be friends!........;o) I figured this would spark some good discussion, and I'm glad it didn't turn into an internet sparring match! Like I said, I think it comes down to the affiliate on case by case basis. Some do it correctly - like yours - while others, unfortunatately, make me want to throw my face through a wall.November 17, 2011 at 7:54 am |
Pete
As is the case with most gyms, regardless of affiliation with Crossfit. I feel there are many things to be angry at within this industry. The pushing of long slow distance training for weight loss or powerplates for, well, anything. Kids spending all their cash on ridiculous supplements and reading works of fiction like Mens Health (sorry!) Crossfit, I feel, should be much further down the list, but each to his own. I will say that Cressey Performance seems to be a beacon for human performance judging from what I have read and seen in your videos (the baseball kids training was inspirational). I do enjoy reading your blog and will continue to do so. Keep up the good work.November 17, 2011 at 11:11 am |
some anonymous bastard
CrossFit is like dentistry, carpentry, or general training and coaching. The person is what makes it good or bad. "CrossFit" is a methodology...i.e. you can apply it as you see fit. The tool can't be blamed for how the carpenter uses it. If you have surgery and find out that a scalpel got left inside you, you don't blame the scalpel. The reason there's so much shitty CrossFit training out there is because of shitty coaches, not the program itself. HQ does program some shitty stuff (I'm an affiliate owner), but lets each gym run its program as it sees fit. We can program what and how we want. Stop hating on CrossFit and start hating on shitty professionalsNovember 17, 2011 at 9:16 am |
Ali
Thank you.November 17, 2011 at 10:41 am |
Bryan Krahn
Interestingly, I was quoted in the CrossFit story -- let's just say the author is definitely not well-versed in strength and conditioning. Perhaps for this particular piece he didn't need to be -- though I still think to write objectively and honestly about boxing you should have at least stepped in the ring a few times and had your nose bloodied. Back to CF -- anything that gets lazy bastards off the couch and into the gym is cool in my books. But CrossFit still gets the "Brown Starfish" award for program design. Those 30 rep snatches might be kosher when you're a newbie throwing around a 65 pound barbell -- but when you're a bigger, stronger guy and start firing up heavier weights? I hope your health insurance covers physiotherapy....November 17, 2011 at 10:21 am |
Ali
Thanks for following up about the author of that story. I could only assume by his website... Just want to be clear here that 30 snatches ("Isabell") is something you MIGHT do once... MAYBE twice per year... not every day. Just like one wouldn't do sets of 30 submaximal deadlifts 3 days per week either... Also the particular workout you are referring to is specifically done with a very light load, so even if you can snatch 205, you certainly aren't going to be doing that 30 times. Nor would any respectable person make you.November 17, 2011 at 10:48 am |
Rees
Best Crossfit response EVER!!!!!!! Idk if I've ever respected someone's ability to handle a situation better. Well done man.November 17, 2011 at 1:56 pm |
Nock
Let me just say THANK YOU TONY for making this statement so I can get a very good detailed info about CrossFit in General. It looks cool on TV and it is something I would love to try one day but I had no clue it was this detailed specially reading Alison's post on top. I think I don't know who it was but the person who said if you look at "CrossFit" as a competitive sport then all that arguing about how good or bad it is goes out the window.November 17, 2011 at 5:58 pm |
Overdue Distractions for your Friday | Hey Joob
[...] Tony Gentilcore What’s in Your Fridge? Stuff to Read While You’re Pretending to Work [...]November 18, 2011 at 7:52 am |
Brett
The problem comes from picking the bad out of something and highlighting it. There's a lot of bad gyms out there and a lot of bad music, but the complete opposite also exists, and that's what I would choose to highlight.The high level crossfitters to me are amazing athletes, but I look at it like bodybuilding in that not everyone could or should be doing it. You wouldnt jump right into Bodybuilding if you have never lifted a weight before, as I don't think you should jump into something as intense as Crossfit without establishing a base first, and perfecting your form before you try and do those movements for time. I've never done Crossfit, but I respect anyone who's doing it safely in a positive environment, each to their own I guess. Tony, I've gotten a few good movie recommendation from your blog so thanks for that, You might have heard of this one, but it's definately worth a look if you havent: http://www.howtodieinoregon.com/trailer.htmlNovember 18, 2011 at 8:06 pm |
Goister
Tony, do you have any ideas on how to improve weighted pullups? Poliquin gave some ideas on how to improve number of bodyweight pullups but none on how to improve weighted pullups. I've been stuck for a long time. I'm about 170lbs and can do >10 bodyweight pullups and my 1RM for weighted pullups is probably about only 50lbs.November 22, 2011 at 3:27 am |
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